Morgxn is an indie-pop artist who has had songs on the top 10 Billboard alternative charts, that Billie Eilish has personally named as inspiration, he has songs featuring Sara Bareilles, and has performed at Lollapalooza, Bumbershoot, on Jimmy Kimmel and more. We talk with Morgxn about how the music industry doesn't seem to actively support artists, the work it can take to break through imposter syndrome and identify as an artist, when not to quit, having enough seats at the table for everyone, farming, and a whole lot more.
Morgxn is an indie-pop artist born and raised in Nashville who has had songs on the top 10 Billboard alternative charts, that Billie Eilish has personally named as inspiration, he has songs featuring Sara Bareilles, and has performed at Lollapalooza, Bumbershoot, on Jimmy Kimmel and more. We talk with Morgxn about the struggles of being in an industry that do a whole lot to actively support artists, the work it can take to break through imposter syndrome and identify as an artist, when not to quit, having enough seats at the table for everyone, farming, and a whole lot more.
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All music written, performed, and produced by Aaron Shafer-Haiss.
Hey, and welcome to today's episode of The Other 22 Hours Podcast. I'm your host, Aaron Shafer-Haiss
[00:00:12] Michaela: And I'm your host, Michaela Anne, and we are in the second year of this podcast. So excited and happy to still be here and happy that you are here with us.
[00:00:21] Aaron: Yeah, a couple things before we jump into the episode.
Making this show is a labor of love, like a lot of really creative endeavors that we take on. And so with that, any bit of support goes a really long way. And there are really three ways you can do that. The easiest is to just subscribe or follow on whatever platform you listen on.
That kind of lets the know that we're worth 45 minutes of your time. The second thing is to share your favorite episode with somebody that doesn't know about our show. Could be this episode or any of the 50 previous episodes. The most direct way to support this show is to subscribe to our Patrion.
we offer a bunch of cool things over there. It's a really cool community. It's a small, but growing community. You can check that out at the link in our bio and we'd appreciate any bit of support.
[00:01:06] Michaela: And one of the things that we pride ourselves on this podcast is that we're not music journalists. We are musicians ourselves.
So we think of these as conversations rather than interviews. Conversations that would happen if we were just hanging out around the dinner table, sharing the very honest reality of what it is to be an artist, building our careers around our art in 2024.
[00:01:28] Aaron: And as we all know really well, most of that is outside of our control.
And so we like to focus these episodes on what is within our control. And that ends up being our mindsets, our routines, our creativity. And we distilled that down to the question, what do you do to create sustainability in your life so that you can sustain your creativity? And today we sat down with Morgan.
[00:01:51] Michaela: Morgan was born and raised here in Nashville, but spent time in New York City and in LA in the Broadway musical world, and then the pop music world. He has had songs on the top 10 billboard charts. He's performed on Jimmy Kimmel. He's played at Lollapalooza, Bumbershoot.
Billie Eilish has named songs of his as her personal inspiration. He's performed with Sara Bareilles. He has had huge highs. As well as lows and disappointments in this career, which makes him all the richer to discuss this type of stuff.
[00:02:25] Aaron: Yeah, and Morgan is just really open about sharing these experiences, these realities, his thoughts in progress. And we have just such an easy flowing conversation here. The general takeaway being there's plenty of room at the table for everybody. And the more open, the more real you are, the more quote unquote successful you can be.
more wholesome it can feel. And that's about the best way we could sum up this episode. So, Without further ado, here's our conversation with Morgan.
[00:02:55] Michaela: well, Thank you so much for doing this, for being here for agreeing to talk to us.
We're really excited to dig in with you.
[00:03:02] Morgxn: Yeah. I'm really excited to be here.
[00:03:04] Michaela: you feel like such a Perfect fit for this podcast because you already so publicly talk about a lot of the stuff that we like to talk about on the podcast, which is essentially like, let's talk about the real stuff going on to be an artist that is also trying to build a career and survive.
And essentially the stuff that we don't put on social media, but you do put it on social media.
[00:03:31] Morgxn: go viral. First of all, I want to throw up every time I hear the word viral post social media, any of it. just putting that out there, but I had a post go viral. That was like, It was something about, I post what I feel for better or for worse, you know? I got engaged last September. I didn't tell people until December because I was like living life, you know, and what I posted was true is I am experiencing the most joy in my life period.
And every time I come to this little box in my hands, I want to scream and cry and run away. And there's such a dissonance between like the life that I'm living my beautiful partner says like, you know, it's hard. You make an album and you're so proud of it. And then every day you have to come against this.
algorithm, capital A, that's like, if I post something and it flops is the whole record a fail? I don't believe it is. I believe that I made a record I'm so proud of. But it's very hard, I think, as an artist in the modern age, where you're like, you've made something, you go to share it, and you're like, Okay, I guess it didn't get heard today and it feels like a failure.
So I posted something that was like, there's such a dissonance between the life I'm living and the joy I feel and the trying to funnel it into this box. that post went viral. And then I sat in a meeting with my label where they're like, we should talk more about that. And I'm like you know, when you reached out, it's like, do you want to talk about that more? And I'm like, do people want me to talk about it more? Because the truth is, I'm seeing so much bubbling to the surface. James Blake is a great example in the last like couple weeks of there is a disconnect between the system that's been created to help music find people and the musicians who are making it.
And I am eternally hopeful and optimistic, but I find myself at a rub right now because I don't know exactly the way through it.
[00:05:42] Aaron: I don't know if anybody does, and I can't remember who said I heard recently. It's like, Oh, you had mentioned it the tech guy that you've been talking to who's creating that new app he's started a bunch of companies and now he's, looking at starting an app. to completely disrupt the music ecosystem and put the power back on the artists.
And it's some kind of social media meets streaming meets monetization thing. But anyway, he was talking about like, giving pushback streaming has been around for long enough now that we're starting to understand it. social media is really like things we're starting to understand.
And he's like, no, what you don't understand is that these companies. are changing their algorithm all the time so that you can't understand it. And so that it perfects itself and you're always going to be reacting to what's, they're changing. And so nobody knows what's going on or what to do.
[00:06:27] Michaela: Another musician had said like, why are you going to start this new app when we're just figuring out what. The system is now and he was like uh, that's not, that's not how this works. And if you think about it, it's like, well, right now, Tik TOK is the leading mode of music discovery.
You know, A few years ago, it was something else. And a few years before that, MySpace was where it happened. And that's not a thing. changes so fast. But the thing that I think is interesting about talking about this stuff, because sometimes one of the pushbacks that I see is. You guys are lucky as artists to live in today's world because so many years ago, you couldn't get music out there without getting a record deal.
And so you guys should just be happy with what you have. But to me, we've democratized. Music by letting everybody access it. And that kind of feels like a justification behind some of the stuff of Spotify being like not doing payouts for anybody who doesn't have more than a thousand or whatever.
To me, it all just feels like more justification for exploitation. Of, we're going to feed on this idea of you guys all want something while we're giving you an avenue. Oh, but we're giving you this avenue that's going to make you feel like even though it's designed to make it incredibly hard to even make a little bit, we're going to make it so that you feel like you're so lucky to be here and you're the only one that's actually struggling with how to make it work
[00:07:52] Morgxn: Yeah, I love that your podcast exists because I just saw another friend like post something similar the other day and I think that it can be so easy to feel like you're isolated within this journey even like how do you make it?
And some people making it more than others. Like it's not a competition in terms of there's only room for five queer people at the table. Do you know what I mean? It's like, to your point I get and understand and appreciate that like I couldn't be a raging queer person the way that I am.
And be as successful as I am in music, literally 10 years ago, like a manager 10 years ago told me I'll never make it in music as an openly gay person in Nashville, and that is, ha ha ha, not true, you know, and that is thrilling. That is exciting you know, zoom out. Music is what, a hundred and 10 years of an industry, do you know what I mean?
Compared to like, coffee making, or like, whiskey. Like, the recorded music industry is nascent.
it's ever evolving. My manager is much older than me. I hope he doesn't take offense to that. But, he is older, and was the head of Atlantic for a long time.
And he was like, I don't know what age you are, but I'm not young. I'm not like old, old. I'm somewhere getting older in a modern time to plug my own music. But, um, he's like, you're not young enough where you're used to every change and you're up on everything, but you're also not old enough to know that literally everything changes.
That is will go away, you know, like you're saying, like it was my space at one point like, et cetera, like who knows what's happening with the algorithm and with Tik TOK, et cetera, it's ever evolving. to speak on the James Blake thing, because I don't know if I made somebody mad, but I was just like, love James Blake.
Like he is one of the few posters I have on my wall, him and wet leg. I love them.
But he changed my life when I heard his soulful voice with the like electronic pop textures. it really inspired the way that I went to make music. And I saw this platform that he shared. And my question is a true question is is it just another Patreon?
offense to Patreon, but is it? model, but how do the producers get paid and how do the songwriters get paid and how do the musicians who are used to royalties based on when it gets used in a movie, etc. it's hard to fix capitalism with capitalism, period, so I have questions as to like, what the way forward is, but I'm at least excited to see people much bigger than me talking about this is a systematic issue that can't be fixed by the same people that got us into this mess.
[00:10:40] Aaron: Yep, absolutely. One of favorite quotes is, If you do what you've done, you're going to get what you have.
[00:10:45] Morgxn: will we?
[00:10:46] Aaron: eventually you need to just grab the steering wheel and jerk it really hard to the left and be like, let's see what happens. That's what Spotify did. if you look at it or, dig deeper Napster or LimeWire or whatever, it was like here,
all at once, take it.
But social media is made for everybody. It's not a music centric, art centric ecosystem. so those numbers, even though it's really easy to internalize that as a reflection of your art and your music and all that, They're your scorecard on how good you are at playing the algorithm.
could be posting anything, there are, woodworkers and 16 year old charcoal pencil sketch artists that have millions of followers,
[00:11:26] Michaela: also, not even how good you are at it, the luck of it and it isn't a place that really is like elevating originality or uniqueness or anything like, it's interesting to me, like being, we have a two year old daughter and now I've because of that, I've started to use Instagram in a whole different way parent stuff and mom stuff and like, follow all these different mom influencers and I'm like, Oh, weird.
There's all these trends that they all just, Oh, they all use the same like audio and do the same thing or the same sketch. It's not like it's really a platform that's like, let's all be our unique selves and celebrate that. It's let's jump on every bandwagon and hashtag to like, find all of the sameness.
it's really counter, In some ways to what it is to really be an artistic person of wanting to create something unique and yourself, if that's even possible in today's moment in history. it's really about like, how do you like blend in so you can be appealing to the masses rather than
[00:12:29] Morgxn: Louie. little thing.
Yeah. I try to push back on anyone who has ever said to me like, Oh my God, musicians are the best content creators. I'm like, I will jump. No, not gonna, I'm not going to say stuff like that. I just, I am not a content creator. Like I just don't create. content. I create music, getting to the point where I could even say that I was a musician.
I have such imposter syndrome. To be able to say I'm an artist, to be able to say I'm a musician, is years of therapy rolled into like a moment where it's hard for me to claim that I'm an artist when there are times I'm making money from other jobs. that used to be something that I was so embarrassed by, I think there's like a Maya Angelou quote where she's like talking about how like, not everyone is, the son of a rich person or whatever kind of thing.
Like when I was living in New York, this is 2009 I needed a job and I had done. the bartender thing already. So like I already took that badge of honor and I went and got my real estate license because my family does real estate and I needed a job and like that was what I did and I felt so embarrassed because I of course wanted to be an artist but like I had a job,
hmm. Mm
and I've come around to realize because of my, finding other jobs along the way to help me keep going is a part of the advice I would give anyone is that it's not just what you do on the two hours where you're on stage or at soundcheck, like a lot of your life needs to be You need to have other jobs to help support the dream.
And that used to feel very scary to say out loud, when I was working in real estate in New York, there was a guy who I showed an apartment to and he is a musician and he had actually won the Grammy for engineering flight of the Concords. I don't look like I'm a. real estate agent, maybe probably everyone's wearing suits and I just like, I can't do that. he's like, what do you really like to do? And I was like, so scared to say, I make music, cause I knew what he did. And I'm like, they're showing him an apartment, and he was like, I'd love to hear it.
And he ended up mixing like the first few songs that I like had recorded professionally, and it never would have happened if I didn't have that. Day job, I'm not trying to advocate for day jobs, but I am trying to advocate for like, it is so much less interesting to me to be like, Oh my God, I came out of nowhere and I've never done anything else.
And like, Oh my God, wow. You know, Because that's just not true. And it's not inspiring either. I way more want to hear how you busted your butt and had other jobs. You know, I think I posted something recently about sitting in a room teaching voice and piano lessons when my song with Tiesto was like blasting at the EDM festival to a hundred thousand people or whatever.
And I'm like teaching this voice lesson and this moment is happening in music because I don't know. That's real to me. I haven't found the way that like, think that you can share those real things in media and have the social media connection or whatever. But um, I think I'm coming to a point where I don't how am I going to say this gently and truthfully?
I think I'm coming to a place where I am going to make music for the rest of my life. No matter what the system supports or encourages, there is, I'm sure you have questions and I'm just gonna keep talking. But um, I have a lot to say on this topic, but I posted something recently about, I think it's time to transition out of the music industry, and I got a lot of messages about it, like, why, like, you're doing so good. And I'm like it's not necessarily for. just me that is feeling this. It's just how do we say we are doing music when the industry is like not having our backs, I see so many friends. sharing this stuff and it hurts to watch artists, friends of mine struggle with this idea. And full disclosure, it was like, I just turned 37.
the emotions are like very high. And I'm curious, what it looks like to step away from the microphone. And when I shared it, I had a lot of great conversations with artists, friends who were like, my producer, Marshall Altman was like, if you're in the music industry and you're not thinking about quitting.
argue, even in the music industry, that one resonates, but the one that I think that resonates the most, that is really making me think about what the point of being an artist in 2024 is, is there's a very big difference between wanting to quit and having nothing left to say.
that for me is like, what is guiding me? I have so much to say. I'm exploring in my life in terms of this farm I'm making with my partner and what it means to be human, , I have so much, I want to say the fact that I'm oscillating between like, is this something I need to walk away from or not is actually proof that I'm doing it.
You know, It's proof that I am an artist in 2024 that I am reckoning with these huge questions.
[00:18:02] Michaela: Well, I think there's also, couple different things in response to all that you just said. One, the whole thing about jobs, having other jobs, I think there's this weird shame around it that we think, oh, you're not really a musician or an artist unless you're making all your money off of it.
And now there's such a growing disparity of like, oh, if you actually are making your money solely from your music, you're one of the lucky ones. It's really hard to do that in today's world. I'm constantly like, I want to know everybody's finances. Like, I'm like, what are your reports? And what are you, like, where are you getting money from?
How are you making money? And I think that's important to talk about because like you said, it trying to separate that I think comes from hearing more and more from people like we had Adia Victoria on here and she plays all the big festivals, she's had record deal with Atlantic and she was just like, I keep a day job.
it also helps me emotionally and mentally to have some separation. Like I don't want the music industry to think that it is my everything.
[00:19:02] Morgxn: Mm. I think that leads into also what you were saying of contemplating quitting or not. There's this idea that it's, all or nothing. You're a person that makes music or are you a machine in the music business that's constantly creating. Yeah. Records and content and your whole presence in the world is only about your music. I hear that even I was talking with a teenager the other day who was like talking about different artists and she was like they just like disappeared for a few years, like no music.
[00:19:31] Michaela: they weren't posting anything. What were they doing? And I was like, Probably living life
[00:19:36] Morgxn: Yeah.
[00:19:36] Michaela: and then they're back, but when you're like 17, I remember thinking that in my twenties of like, what have you been doing for 20 years? If you're 40 years old and you haven't gotten to where you want to be.
And I'm 37 and there's a lot of ways I haven't gotten to where I want to be and a lot of ways that life is better than I could have dreamed. And I'm like, a lot of life has happened in my adulthood. A lot more than just making music.
[00:20:03] Aaron: what resonated with me with what you said was, using what you have to say as a barometer for whether to step away.
And there is a lot to be said about having an outside source of income separate from your art that allows you to truly say what you want to say in the most like real way. authentic way. I've brought it up a few times on this podcast, but there's a book called Real Artists Don't Starve
intriguing title.
It's like a C plus book, but the best part in there is he brings up all these renaissance painters like oh, he's a legendary artist. He worked on commission a lot of the time. And so he was getting paid to paint certain things.
he also then had the freedom to paint what he wanted. Outside of that but most artists throughout history have had a benefactor whether it was like, a king or you know some other monarch paying them to create art or whatever it was and for some reason in modern times, there's a stigma about basically your day job being your benefactor
There is a freedom there when you have that outside income, but I hear you there is You such a stigma around claiming, I have a day job both like internally and externally.
if you can imagine and fast forward, I would guess I'm 38, so we're, we're in the same stage. If you can fast forward to being 75 and sitting on your porch or whatever it is. And looking back, I personally would love to be able to look back on this. portfolio of art that I created and it's not going to matter how I funded it Whether I funded it from like tours or a record label or what or if I funded it from like pounding nails if I was proud of the art that I made.
[00:21:43] Morgxn: Amen.
[00:21:44] Michaela: a lot of what you talk about is this state of industry and changes in the pandemic, how it's all affected you personally, but that it's within this context of how it affects everybody. But I'm wondering how you've personally processed and grappled with all that has happened in the past few years of, a record deal, and a hit record, things going great, and then the pandemic hit, label dropped you, feels like everything falls apart, taken away, and then, You started putting out songs independently and went really well for you, And all of those lessons and that feeling of this stuff out of my control in the world and the industry has impacted me, but it's also impacting a lot of other people. But how do you personally come to terms with that? And has there been a grieving process and a, regaining strength and confidence process?
what does that look like for you? In a vacuum of just yourself.
[00:22:41] Morgxn: Interesting. played an event a couple of days ago and I was like, I don't want to trigger anyone, but let's just drop in to March of 2020, you know, and everyone's like, oh,
Laughter
and it's like, It's not that interesting to talk about what I knew was going to happen that didn't happen because we all faced that.
But I, I dropped us into that moment where March of 2020, and this is like banging the trash cans in the pots and pans. Cause we're like, separate, but we're connected. You know, There was like this moment that felt like we're all going through this, no matter the socioeconomic thing is naive of me to think.
But. It felt like we were disconnected, but also so, one in that moment. And that was the moment that I was dropped from my record label. And it felt like that was the end of everything, all I knew how to reach people was the machine in which I was a part of, it sounds like made up press story, but like, if it weren't for Billie Eilish, tweeting about me and she posted like a list of five songs that inspired bad guy. And one of them was my song
That happened the same day I was dropped. while I was experiencing this, like very low, I was also getting this endorphin high know, again, Impostor Syndrome, I'm like, I made something that like inspired somebody that I think she's awesome like, have always thought she was awesome and has continued to blow me away, I think back to that moment because it was as if the veil had been lifted and it was like, okay, what do I want to share?
And what was on my heart was, I wonder if anyone will hear this. And I wonder if I'll go broke trying to keep on, And that song wonder I think it helped bridge the gap between What was the pre pandemic feeling and this sort of entering into the pandemic. I will say that I put so much into wonder, I just down as we all were.
And it was just like, wonder wonder. That song went viral at every platform. And because of that song, independently, like I made more money from music than I had ever made before, it was again, like the matrix had been lifted. And I could see that there was a different way to do music.
I think the process of grief is an interesting one to talk about with the pandemic because, in 2015 I lost my dad and it was like a deep, terrible grief. And I think that for anyone who's ever experienced like deep, terrible grief, the pandemic was like a reminder of what deep, terrible grief feels like, because you're grieving not necessarily a person, but you're grieving a life you thought would be And for me, that happened.
grieved like a career and a life that I thought I was going to have. And I don't think that I would have been open to all of the changes that happened. It sounds like I'm saying it's a positive thing, but in a way the pandemic was so hard that it was what gave me an opening to move back home, meet my partner and embark on other journeys that, who knows what happens with our farm, but like, the grief and pain of the pandemic led me to a new Path in a way, it's hard because while I'm saying like, there's a difference between wanting to quit and having nothing left to say, and I'm saying I have so much to say, I still feel like I woke up today and I was like, maybe I should quit, and then I, Just looked at my bank account and there was some money from music, and I'm like, man, it's wild, the way that I don't know the linear path towards music anymore, but maybe that's the most powerful thing in the world is to say, I don't know, I don't know how I'm going to keep going.
I'm just gonna be honest about how it feels and hope that more people have conversations like this that might make other artists feel less alone as we navigate this complete unknown.
[00:26:50] Aaron: Yeah. Absolutely. I think scientific studies on how the human brain likes and comfort. And so in, knowing, in a way, in essence, putting like the psychic blinders on, it keeps things predictable and the same. And so if you're able to wholeheartedly say, I don't know, that triggers your brain to open and look at other possibilities.
And I think that's what happened for everybody during the pandemic is. All of a sudden, everything that everybody knew came to a grinding halt. what happens now?
And you find all of these people finding new pathways
new openings because it's just sitting there and going, I don't know. And being open to something new,
[00:27:30] Morgxn: I think people either went two ways in the pandemic. They either went to, I don't know, or they went to, I know so hard that they went crazy. You know, it's like, all of the people that, were just like, I know, I'm like, You just shattered your reality and I don't know that I'll ever see you again, but we don't have to talk about that more, but I had a song in the pandemic called losing myself the content I made for it.
It wasn't it. don't do content. I just, I make things that feel good and aligned to whatever I'm trying to share, I jumped out of a plane for the first time. I went skydiving, and so that was like some of the video that I put with the song Losing Myself. It was so exhilarating, jumping out of a plane. The guy, he was like, normally people are like, really like calm on the ground. And then as they get higher, they get scared. He's like, you seemed a little like nervous when you were like on the ground.
But he was like, as we ascended, you got calmer. And I think that's like a perfect metaphor for my life because I felt my feet ground. And remember thinking, it's weird to feel so grounded when I'm like 15, 000 feet in the air, you know? and then you're just like, you're at this threshold and you just fall out the plane and it's, there's no turning back.
But the song Losing Myself, the idea was in order to be lost, You have to know what found means. You know what I mean? Like in order for lost to exist, that implies that found is something you know and, know that you're not there, I love music. I love art.
I love artists. I love people who, think people who feel and try to reflect what they see in the world. that's what art is to me. I wish the system supported more people. Of course there's the statistic about how much independent art Spotify like paid out last year.
And like, that's true. And full disclosure, I made more money from Spotify than any other platform as an independent artist. So like that is a true statement, but I still think it's an unfair place for so many artists and wish that would change. Period.
[00:29:37] Michaela: Well, I think also what you were talking about of the not knowing. Not knowing what's gonna happen, not knowing the path and how, frightening that can be, but at the same time, the freedom in that thinking back on March, 2020 of the things that didn't happen that you said you knew were going to happen, but didn't happen.
it was a turning point for a lot of us to kind of learn that hard lesson of growing up. That is just the truth of life of you don't know and grieving the life that we thought we were going to have the experiences we thought we were going to have. And yet having gratitude for the new path.
The new life that you've built that you probably wouldn't have if all those other things hadn't been lost. That's like such an in between that at some point I think everyone learns if they're That's a part of life, but it's such an, critical thing to know and figure out how to accept. I think especially if you are on a life path as an artist or in a career, any type of career entrepreneurial stuff I mean, I think it's for any life because even if you have a stable job, anything can happen, but that kind of healthy detachment you expect to happen is one of the hardest things I think for me as someone who's a dreamer and then has expectations and so emotional and get crushed from from not meeting those expectations and, and music that happens all the time.
what does that summon for you if you think about
[00:31:09] Morgxn: I have thoughts.
[00:31:10] Michaela: okay, yeah. Yeah.
[00:31:11] Morgxn: not somebody who believes in the advice of like, it's better to lower your expectations and then be excited about what you get, et cetera. I don't live like that. I am a dreamer through and through, I have a friend who matched with somebody on a dating app and they're like, I think they're the one or, you know, whatever. And I'm, I'm never going to shoot down excitement. You know, yeah, you may get your heart broken and they may be absolutely crazy, but like, I would much rather walk into life with the excitement of what could be. And sure, I've been crushed by the reality of what it has been, but I would never take away.
The hope and the joy that one day could change your life you know, your art could reach the masses and that, dream happens. You know, I actually have something written down here and it's have the big dream, but don't let it blind you from all the tiny miracles happening all around you and inside of you.
that's hard because my dream is so big, you know, like the thing I want to do is so huge and I've had to reframe it. At this event that I played there, it was, there was a lot of beauty influencers, actual beauty influencers. And I again feel like a fraud because I'm like, I'm there because I made a song, Wonder, that really speaks to the idea of having a dream and going for it.
But y'all are very good at content. It's a lot, like they go through a lot like trying to do it and there was a lot of beauty influencers who are new mothers there. And actually one of them had their three month old with them at this event. I was grateful to the brand for I'll just say the brand, they're not paying me to say it, but Philosophy Skincare.
I was so impressed that the brand was allowing, mothers with their children to come to this influencer event because it's just so hard to do the daycare with the going to the event. But in a way, I don't know motherhood. we don't plan on having kids, I can't speak exactly to it. But it's like, that is a new chapter in some of these women's life where they're doing one thing and then they have, this other job that comes into the job that they're doing.
And it's inspiring seeing companies support that and brands support that and influencers who are sharing the journey as you talked about, When I see artists sharing what is real about their process in their life, I'm always in their DMs being like, Please share more of that. Please share you juggling, all the things that you're doing in the journey of being an artist, I can't wait to stream your song, but I actually can't wait to see you, carrying your baby to soundcheck and doing the thing.
You know, My, one of my former drummers, like he brought his kid to a soundcheck recently and the, son was like playing drums. And I was like, I know your drumming is great, but honestly, all I want to see is your son playing your drum kit. You know what I mean?
[00:34:06] Michaela: There's two belief systems in it there still are people out there. I just had a friend recently tell me that her manager prefers that she shows more of her rock star musician self on social media and not her woman human self. And I was like, Oh, like going like, and I feel the way that you feel some people are like, if you're a musician, you need to fake it till you make it act like you're a rock star, like show, all the hottest pictures and looking at your best and on stage and make sure it looks like there's tons of people there.
And I'm like. That's just not my personality, and also, like you, it's not what I like as a fan. I like to see that stuff, but I also like to see realness. I like to see truth. I'm more attracted when people are like, this is what I went through to get here. Not, this is the exciting, great moment.
So it's cool to hear and see. I do think there is a budding movement of people wanting that maybe because we've swung so far to the other end with, Reality shows and social media where it's this like false sense of reality. Everyone's like doing a lot to make sure that they're in full makeup with their, plastic surgery face.
And like, to look better than we all do on our own. And now we're like, Oh, it's weird. Why are we all so depressed? Cause we were like trying to live up to these unreal expectations that cost so much time and resources and money to try and create for ourselves.
I think there is a movement of people that are like, I want to feel what's real and I want to have real connection through sharing our realities.
[00:35:42] Morgxn: yeah. Dan Wilson, the songwriter, Closing Time but also Someone Like You for Adele and lots of things. I remember sometime I read maybe a tweet of his, I don't remember back when Twitter was a thing. he was like, I try to think of every post as I'm sending like, a love letter to like, Somebody I know and somebody I don't know, everything he shares is intended to be like a, gift. it's hard to think of social media as a gift for somebody else, and I'm not a martyr and I'm not perfect, but I, really don't spend my time and energy being like, how is what I'm posting going to make people feel jealous that this is happening?
it's just not interesting to me, but how can something I share be resonant for somebody, how can something I share be informational and helpful to somebody else? with Wonder and with Sara Bareilles singing on it, like that journey, 12 years ago when I wanted to get started and she had love song out, like I had sent her an email asking for advice and she responded with like paragraphs of advice, and to this day, it is the reason why when I get an email from somebody that's like, I have questions, doubts, anything. I'm like, Let me give you some, because it's not like, Hey, can you get me into this session? But it's like, college kid who's like, Hey, I'm interviewing people for like, doing music.
Can I talk to you? And then they're like, surprised that I'm like, yeah. You know, because, that part of the internet actually does. make me feel hopeful and that I'm grateful the internet exists, I think that's where I turn my discomfort and dis ease with the landscape of social media into something like what is this?
tool helpful for it. And I feel like there is ways for connection. We connected through the internet. I don't think we've met.
[00:37:35] Michaela: We've never met in person. No. I think we have quite a few mutual real life friends like that.
[00:37:40] Morgxn: Yeah. We have to meet,
[00:37:41] Michaela: I know we've, I think we've been at the Capitol at the same time.
[00:37:46] Morgxn: you know, as you do
[00:37:48] Michaela: Yeah.
[00:37:48] Morgxn: always something to sing about.
[00:37:50] Michaela: Yeah. In Tennessee for sure. I saw on your website though, what is vital project? Can you share a little bit about that?
[00:37:57] Morgxn: Yeah, the what is vital project is like a decade long project that was born out of wanting to find a way to Create art and give back to communities and it started as like school workshops like in public schools in Los Angeles is actually where it began but The what is vital project itself that it is right now was actually born in the pandemic because there were so many people doing like go fund me and Venmo like save this thing.
And all of that is great and would never, knock emergency funding. But sometimes the structure of that doesn't support longevity enough. So my brother, who is more finance based helped me and my friend Annie, who is creative theater management background, to uh, What is vital project have fiscal sponsorship through fractured Atlas, which allows for donations to come into what is vital project that are tax deductible for the people donating.
And then all of that money can be used a hundred percent as grants to artists to make what is vital to them across many different mediums. it allows for giving to happen, In a tax deductible way, and then all of that money to be used towards artists, not to pay rent, because that's a specific thing that I wish I could help artists do anything, but the money has to be used for the creation of their art, whether that's like materials, rental space, instruments, we've had musicians, we've had choreographers, we've had visual artists, we've had, just recently a photography project that we could help pay for like, film and dark room, whatever that, that process is.
But that was born out of the pandemic trying to find a way to give back in a way that could hopefully be something I can grow.
[00:39:51] Aaron: That's incredible. Talk about benefactors and, creating the safety net to be able to make the art vital, that you need to
[00:39:59] Morgxn: Yeah. It's not the most money and it's, something that like, it is hard to raise money as a nonprofit to then give the money away and figure out how to grow the nonprofit so that we can give more money away basically. But like, America is a messed up place.
other countries have these kinds of grants are built into the government, Canada, Australia, you can get money to record your album from the government, because that's how the government works there. You know, I'm not saying that those places are perfect, but like, there's way more small grant giving from the government in other countries.
And this, the what is vital project is truly like small grant. to artists to make what is vital to them. And I hope that as my career grows, part of the big dream that I have, I can grow what is vital project into giving away more money so that other artists can choose to do their art in a moment where they need to choose between doing their art and paying their rent,
[00:41:00] Aaron: That's incredible. I just want to note to anybody listening that's interested in learning more about that, whether as a receiver or as a donator, we'll put a link in the show notes to this so you can definitely check that out.
[00:41:10] Michaela: Yeah. I think about that all the time, that one, any amount of money is so helpful For anyone to receive sometimes I think we can think like, Oh, I mean, what's 500. Well, that's, mixing a song or goes really far for a lot of people who are, still struggling to just pay their rent and then to have any little bit to help cover different expenses. And two, there's so much money out there.
It is just very unequally distributed and we think it's distributed based on who works the hardest to receive it and that's just not how it works. That's not, real. That's not actually capitalism. So I feel like continually finding ways to create this abundant financial abundance to share.
Yeah, it's, they don't make it easy for sure. And there are many artist friends of mine who, one of the projects that we worked on, we were one of many of the. Grants and things that they had applied for that helped to fund their projects.
[00:42:13] Morgxn: Like we were not at all the sole, grant of money to this project, but we were a part of a group of grants that they secured in order to do the art, which is again, I wish it were easier. in America but yeah that's, they don't make it easy for you to find out how to do it, in Nashville they're trying to get, more grants to small artists.
I mean, we're in the middle of that fight, right now where it's like, not all the money should be going to these like large organizations. It should be going to small. Grants, you know, I would love to see that trend continue.
[00:42:46] Michaela: Yeah. Cool.
[00:42:47] Aaron: Before we go, your other project is you're building a farm.
Oh, yeah. The other, the other
[00:42:53] Michaela: part of, the other, you know, very easy industry to start working.
[00:42:57] Morgxn: Yeah, very big dream. Luckily I have a partner who like we are getting our hands dirty doing everything, we built a shower two days ago. He and I,
[00:43:06] Michaela: An outdoor shower?
[00:43:07] Morgxn: this one is an indoor shower.
[00:43:09] Michaela: Okay. I was like, I'm coming
[00:43:12] Morgxn: we want to build, we want to build another cabin and have an outdoor shower.
Like These are big dreams, but we're going to plant an orchard. It's going to be something that, people can come to the orchard. Also like market gardens and farmer's market, like that's going to be something that we explore. Um, But right now, it's just a a beautiful project that the two of us are As my song also says, young and in love in the mess that we made, we are just getting our hands dirty and I'm learning a lot.
He has way more skill than I do. He's actually like the one that does most of the work and I'm the one who goes on interviews and podcasts and talks about it. Um, yeah, I was like, we have like ring notifications or whatever. And like, I think I was like talking to like Billboard or something, and I got a notification and I just looked at it and he was like chopping down a tree and like carrying it like on his back like, you know, to go plant somewhere else or whatever. And I'm just like, I'm doing like an interview about this and he's doing the work. Cool.
Cool. Cool.
[00:44:22] Michaela: Yeah, we're, we're in our recording studio that Aaron designed and built with his own hands with his dad, who is a contractor, but Aaron did the physical labor. And I'm always like, yeah, we built a studio. we built it.
[00:44:35] Morgxn: I love he's, he's always like, we did this. And I'm just like, I love that. I want to encourage more of that always. But like, I do also want to acknowledge, I know that you did it,
[00:44:44] Michaela: There's a lot to be said for emotional support.
[00:44:46] Morgxn: there's a lot to be said.
[00:44:47] Aaron: too. like, hey, we need to do this,
[00:44:49] Morgxn: We just talked about water lines today and he was like, that's a great idea. And I was like, see, I've got ideas, you know, like it's wild. Wait. You can do I think a week or two ago, like we like fully did all the piping and plumbing for the laundry room, you know, and it's just like, wow, there's so much that goes into it.
But like also his dad pours concrete like big concrete projects. So Gabe grew up doing a lot of this stuff. But I'm just, blown away by anyone who can do building things. It's, It's remarkable.
[00:45:24] Aaron: there's something really satisfying about the work that's very tangible. You can see, you start in the morning and at the end of the day, you can look and be like, We did that. You can, You can see, you can touch the difference
[00:45:34] Morgxn: also, he has a degree in religion and studio art and is by day a therapist. But there's so much to like studio art. there's so much to like art and design to the like building thing, you know? And there's also like, no professional engineer is going to like love me for saying this, but it's sometimes it's like, Oh my gosh, it's like Legos.
You know what I mean? You're just like the pipes and you're just Oh my goodness, look, they're just making a pipe. You know, Of course there's other stuff that goes into it. I know, but some days it's like, we're just children who grew up and are engaged in making things,
[00:46:10] Michaela: definitely.
[00:46:11] Aaron: And it's a great outlet, too.
[00:46:13] Morgxn: I feel like I could do a whole podcast just talking about this stuff, there are moments where I'm like cleaning the gutters and I'm like, I'm a pop star. What am I doing? You know? And then I'm like, you know what? Yeah, I'm a pop star and I clean gutters.
You know what I mean? That's, That's the quote.
yeah
[00:46:32] Aaron: exactly i think it was vance powell do you know him the engineer he owns sputnik and has worked on everything from chris tableton to jack white stuff to a ton I think he was telling the story about himself and he was saying, the first time he got the call that he had won a Grammy, he was on his back porch just like picking up tons of dog shit, you know?
And he's like, this is what I'm doing. This is my life. So,
[00:46:54] Morgxn: I hope for a beautiful life of all of that.
[00:46:59] Michaela: Yeah.
[00:46:59] Morgxn: Definitely.
[00:47:01] Aaron: there's such a theme I'm picking up on like everything that we've talked about and your viewpoint to me of like inviting people in, creating space being welcoming, being open And it's just so rejuvenating to me. I just want to, note that and want to thank you again for taking time to be with us here today and to share your experience and all of this.
[00:47:21] Morgxn: I loved getting to chat I love what this podcast is about and I can't wait to hang out with y'all
[00:47:27] Michaela: Yeah. Yeah, likewise.
[00:47:28] Morgxn: All right.
[00:47:29] Aaron: Morgan. Have a great day.
[00:47:31] Morgxn: Bye.